Interview with José Argüelles/Valum Votan before the Harmonic Convergence 1987.

Publicado por Unidad de Ciencias Noosféricas Mexxicamelot

I share this interview that was made to Valum Votan before the Harmonic Convergence in 1987 that is still as current today as it was when it was made. It clears once and for all that the first one to establish that the closing of the cycle towards 2012 that we are presently living from the Mayan and Galactic perspective was him.

Honor to the one that honor deserves...

In lak' ech!

Aida - Hun Ik


Credit to:

Tonight's conference (July 12, 1987) is with Dr. Jose Arguelles, who has
gained national publicity for his claim a new age is beginning next month.

% The Jose Arguelles and The New Age conference is beginning.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Good evening, everyone, and welcome to our conference with
Dr. Arguelles of Boulder, Col., who has a controversial message for the
world. Dr. Arguelles has captured the attention of many people with his claim
that a New Age will begin on earth in approximately one month. Dr. Arguelles
was born in 1939 and spent his early childhood in Mexico. After receiving his
PH.D. in Art History from the University of Chicago, Dr. Arguelles taught at
Princeton University, the University of California at Davis and at the Naropa
Institute. In 1970 he organized the first Whole Earth Festival in Davis which
some say launched the ecology movement. He has studied the Mayan culture for
three decades and has written three books including "The Mandala"," Earth
Ascending" and his latest entitled "The Mayan Factor," which has become an
underground best seller of sorts. Dr. Arguelles is currently a core faculty
member and program coordinator of Creative Arts for Union Graduate School and
director of the Planetary Art Network, a global association of artists and
creative individuals working for "dynamic transformation of the planet."

(Dave Peyton)<2> Welcome, Dr. Arguelles, to our conference. I'd like to begin
the questioning, while others are getting in line for questions, by asking to
describe briefly where you obtained your belief that a new age is dawning next

(Jose Arguelles)<12> This belief comes from a study of the Mayan Calendar
which I discoverd actually describes the passage of earth and our solar system
through a beam 5125 years in diameter. We entered this beam in 3113 BC and
leave the Beam in 2012 AD. August 16/17 1987 marks the point in the beam when
there is a break in the wave harmonic that this beam represents. The date
also corresponds to prophecies concerning the return of the god/hero
Quetzalcoatl/Kukulkan as well as various other intertribal prophecies calling
for 144,000 awakened sundancers to dance the new age into being.

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, if you're finished with that answer we'll go on to some
questions from the audience. Ready?

% Moderator recognizes queue #1 John H. <16>

(Dave Peyton)<2> John H. Go!

(John H.)<16> Hello, Mr. Arguelles mentioned that there will be a proliferance
of UFO's during the new age. Will there be many and where will they occur?.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Yes, I believe there will considerable UFO activity.
More importantly, I believe there there will be a message collectively
received. The UFOs will be in many places. Perhaps at so-called sacred sites,
but maybe in largely populated centers as well.

(John H.)<16> I see. Will there be many in the U.S.?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Yes, I think there will be a number of sightings in the

(Dave Peyton)<2> Finished, John?

(John H.)<16> Yes, thank you very much.

% Moderator recognizes queue #2 Steven Hirsch <10>

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, Steve!

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Thank you. Dr. Arguelles, I am a Naropa Grad and
editor/publisher of Heaven Bone. I believe our poems appeared together in the
recent issue of The Windhorse Review. I am referring to your poem "This Is The
Moment". You had some remarkable experiences when you were a child that
awakened you spiritually. Did you or were you abducted or contacted by star
people and/or thin insect eyed beings as described in Whitley Streiber's book

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Yes, I had a number of "awakening" experiences. In
retrospect, now I beleive I was contacted by starpeople preparing me for my

(Dave Peyton)<2> Anything else Steve?

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Yes, I agree. yes. I remember Mr. Streiber describing
the extraterrestrials as communicating to him telepathicly, showing him images
of the destruction of our planet in a ball of fire. Do you take this
literally, or can it be, as I believe, that the world is going to go through
a purification and cleansing to elevate our energies. What do you see as
happenning in regards to this purification by fire?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> The world will not be destroyed, nor will it undergo a
purification by fire. The point now is that the time has come for us
excercise our free will and magnetize an invitation to the star people that we
are ready for them to as assist us in whatever way they can according to our
needs and our abilities. There will be a purification, but it will be easier
if we accept that we must purifiy ourselves and our way of life . This means
turning away from militarism and industrial way of life. There are other
technologiesa available to us that are non-polluting. The point is that the
race is over. We can get out of the car and walk now!

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Thank you.

% Moderator recognizes queue #3 PAUL DAVENPORT <6>

(Dave Peyton)<2> Go, Paul!

(PAUL DAVENPORT)<6> Dr. Who are THEY.?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> THEY are our friends the starpeople, galactic
intelligence, the federation.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Anything else Paul?

(PAUL DAVENPORT)<6> NO, thanks.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Dr., Are they from this galaxy?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Yes, they are. They are from places like the Pleiades,
Arcturus, Sirius and Antares. THey are also from other dimensions.

% Moderator recognizes queue #4 DAVE HOFFMANN <14>

(Dave Peyton)<2> Dave, your turn!

(DAVE HOFFMANN)<14> Hello-- of all those who have been in touch with spirit,
why was it the Mayans who got the date of such a major change ?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Because the Mayans were originally from more advanced
interplanetary civilization. They came here specifically to show two things:
one, that it is possible to live in harmony with all of life with very minimal
technology as we know it; and two, to leave behind a code that unlocks the
keys to how our life--DNA--is in resonance with galactic forces and energies.
This code also functions as the calendar. Everything operates
holographically. We are holograms of the earth, as the earth is of us, and of
the solar system and galaxy as well.

% Moderator recognizes queue #6 Mike Jones <5>

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, Mike

(Mike Jones)<5> Good Evening. Dr., you mention that 144,000 people will be
"chosen" to start this new age. Will all of these people know that they have
been chosen, and if so, by what means?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> The 144,000 people are self-selected. No one is keeping
tabs. The point is to create a planeatary field of trust. These 144,000 will
form a planetary human-to-human power grid that will ground the new
frequencies coming in at that time. They will catalyze these frequencies by
remaining in their integrity. Their power will be equal to the square of
their number 20,736,000! Through them and those attuned to them, there will
be an awakening kind of experience that will catalyze a positive vision of our
common destiny into being. The World will be different as a result. And
everybody will know it.

(Mike Jones)<5> I certainly hope you are right. Thank you.

(Dave Peyton)<2>Dr., it sounds like a new religion. Is it?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Yes, in a way it is a new religion: the religion of the
earth, a religion that encompasses all religions and beliefs by shadowing our
oneness with the earth and all of life. A religion galactically attuned to the
new frequencies so that the timeless values of service and compassion for the
higher good will be re-established in the hearts of humankind once again.

% Moderator recognizes queue #7 Michael Mac Cannell <3>

(Dave Peyton)<2> Michael: You're up!

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> Dr. Arguelles assuming enough people don't form a
grid doesn't that give you an easy "out"?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> I suppose you could say that. But, I'm not in this for an
easy in or an easy out. The point is that the world is in a terrible mess,
and it is time that we excercise our free will and do something about. We know
that we are not alone, and all of the information points to the fact that we
can get help if we want to.

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> May I ask how do the starpeople manifest themselves
to you?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> The starpeople manifest themselves to me psychically
through different visual and auditory frequencies. They also manifest
themselves to me through a person who calls himself D.Treadwell or Actara who
is now on this planet and has been communicating to me by phone from Santa
Fe, NM for the last 3 months. He has been very helpful in confirming much of
the informnation I have been dealing with.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Dr., why would a star person contact you by phone; that's
rather "low tech" isn't it?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> It may be "low tech," but it is also humble and

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> Is D. Treadwell a channel?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> No, D.Treadwell is not a channel. He is an actual
person, who describes himself as a "light being."

(Dave Peyton)<2> Hmmm! Interesting!.

% Moderator recognizes queue #8 DAVID CHERNIACK & F <4>

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, David.

(DAVID CHERNIACK & F)<4> We have a technical question here about the nature of
the break in the harmonics of the beam on the 16th/17th of Aug. Also, is
there a particular point in time that this will happen?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> The break in the resonant field will be experienced as a
mildly rolling type of feeling. What it will do to existing elctrical or
related power lines I'm not sure. Nor am I certain exactly when it will
occur. Odds have it that it will occur in multiple instances, certainly by
dawn of the 16th somehting will be felt, and most certainly by dawn of the
17th an even stronger sensation of it will be experienced.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Anything else, David?

(DAVID CHERNIACK & F)<4> Will music be significant as a vehicle for raising
spiritual consciousness?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Music or harmonics of whatever kind will most certainly
help. But I must emphasize that the most important thing is for people to be
in their integrity, with purified intention and holding on to nothing. This
is because every human being is an electromagnetic wave-form. Being in your
integrity means being completely identified with your waveve-form so that you
are in resonance with yourself and are not creating static in your field by
giving your power to something outside of yourself. In this way the incoming
frequencies may pass through you undisturbed and be received by the earth,
recharged and sent back up through. The whole energy exchange will form a
figure 8 type of patter. Everyone is potentially a vertical connector. The
point is to be in your integrity in your innocence and trust, with your
receivers--your sense organs--wide open. It's all very simple!!!

(Dave Peyton)<2> A question here. Will this rolling feeling be akin to an
earthquake and it will be registered as such by scientists?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> I don't think it will be like an earthquake. It will
certainly be felt and I encourage scientists to be out in the field. It may
be that it can also be registered by some kind of instrumentation, but at
this point I'm not sure what kind. Also, this experience will be very much
like continuous deja vu. Things will be remembered that have been long
forgotten, and that's great!

(Dave Peyton)<2> Even non-believers will feel it?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Even non-beleivers driving bulldozers through the Amazon
jungle will experience something, one too many deja vus!

I'd like to add that much of this information and the background to it is
available in book the Mayan Factor: Path beyond Technology, published by Bear
and Co. Santa FE, NM 87504.

% Moderator recognizes queue #10 Michael <18>

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, Michael.

(Michael)<18> First of all, my name is Michael Collier and I am editor of the
Network of Light. We have two days worth of events scheduled in
Buffalo/Niagara Falls. If anyone wants info, leave E-mail (73230,1163). I have
several questions--first, what will the average Joe notice/experience on these

(Jose Arguelles)<12> The average Joe will experience--woops, add, average
Jose---will expereince feelings of deja vu, which may seem somewhat out of
the ordinary maybe even slightly confusing but not unpleasant. It is also
important to keep in mind that the UFO sightings will command great media
attention, and everyone will know something different, and even exciting is
happening. It will be important for people like yourself and the Networks of
Light all over the world to be in a condition of non-judgement a and
compassion, especially on the days afterward so that all can be properly
helped and informed about what is going on.

(Michael)<18> I understand that in addition to the ending of the Mayan
calendar, several other major and minor cycles culminate around 8/16. Do you
know anything about this?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> The name of the game is cycling. Nothing is really ending
but the old order, the actual conclusion of this phase of the Mayan calendar
known as the Great Cycle occurs in 2012. What actually ends on August 16 is
a sub-cycle of that calendar known as the Nine Hells which began the day
Cortez landed in Mexico. What begins on August 17 is the Sixth Sun and the
commencement of a period of 13 Heaven Cycles. There is a 25 year period
between August 1987 and Decenber 2012. This period of time will include a
five year purification period--the Campaign for the Earth--and by 1992, a
final 20 year cycle known as the Earth Regneration period during which time
we will prepare for a major galactic synchronization a hook-up with the
galactic fleet in 2012. By 1992 the space brothers and sisters will be
assisting us in ways undreamed of right now. This is our great chance. Every
planet deserves a break. This is ours!

(Dave Peyton)<2> Another question, Michael?

(Michael)<18> Yes, I'd like to know what other individuals, groups, channels,
etc. have been receiving info concerning the significance of this date
independently of you.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> At this point in time the number of groups and channels
receiving information and instructions concerning this event is too immense
to ennumerate. It is a world-wide phenomena. Everyday I receive more and
information. The amazing thing is that it is virtually all the same message.
The time has come. The galactic intelligence is ready and waiting. People
get ready, there's a train a-comin'! This being the case go ahead and stand
by your stations for further instructions. I would also add that by merely
doing this particular conference in its electromagnetic form we are sending
out further confirmation to the galactic intelligence that we are ready.
"Something wonderful is about to happen." If I may quote the astronaut from
the film 2010.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Does that mean they are monitoring this conference?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> I beleive it does.

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK. Welcome to them, too.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Michael, I think we must move on to another questioner.

% Moderator recognizes queue #11 MIKE CHRISTIE <20>

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, Mike

(MIKE CHRISTIE)<20> What does the person working in the city on 8/16 & 17 do
to participate?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> If you are working in the city, or better yet, if you are
in the city and know people in media or communications in the city, get the
word out to them about this. In any case, if you are in the city and cannot
get away, the important message still is to remain in your integrity.
Take note and be with your friends. Everything is OK. Everyone is perfect
just the way they are. We're all a part of a galactic Mr. Rogers neighborhood!

(Dave Peyton)<2> Where will you be, Dr. Arguelles?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> To tell you the truth I still really don't know. I'm
hanging wide open right now because so much stuff is coming through. But you
can bet your bottom dollar I'll be somewhere on this planet!!!

(MIKE CHRISTIE)<20> Thank you No. But thanks Dr., I needed to hear (read!)

% Moderator recognizes queue #14 Steven Hirsch <10>

(Dave Peyton)<2> Ok, Steven.

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Thank you. I have two questions. First, besides being
editor of Heaven Bone Magazine, I am a jeweler, gem cutter, and crystal
merchant. Have you recieved and information for those of us expressing our
love for the planet through communion with the mineral kingdom. I am going
up to Herkimer, NY. next week to mine for Herkimer diamonds. Do you have any
good ideas about what to do with them. Some crystal patterns perhaps? Are
there any other rituals or preparations you would recommend for those of us
with some lesiure?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Recent geophysical studies are showing that the earth is
actually a crystal or very crystalline in nature and in properties of
behavior (see current issue of OMNI). So crystals are telling us to be more
attuned the earth. They are earth's resonant transductor helpers. So if
you're into crystals, or even if you're not into crystals, having one with
you helps, esepcailly on Harmonic Convergence. There are some rituals
involving crystals, using people to form star-of-david patterns with them, and
that kind of thing. But it is also very important to be very careful with
what you do with them. Again intention is of the essense.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Another question, Steven?

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Thank you. I have one more question, I am a buddhist.
During the Kalachakra practice there is mention of a dark age of man or
something to that effect. There was also a timetable involved. Are you
familiar with this (I know you are) and what are the correspondances of this
tantra to the Harmonic Convergence and related literature?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> According to the Kalachakra and the related teachings of
Shambhala, we are now in the darkest of the dark ages,actually concluding a
500 year dark-age which seems to correspond to the 468 year Nine Hell
periods I referred to earlier. This means that, according to these prophecies
(Shambhala) that the time of the reign of the 3 Lords of Materialism is
close to an end. This will be followed by a 500--year Golden Age. It seems
that the 500 year Golden Age would begin about 2012, if we are on schedule. I
have checked some of this out with Tai Situ Rinpoche, just to be sure. In any
case, yes, there is definitely a correspondence. One more reason why it's
called Harmonic Convergence.

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Thank you

% Moderator recognizes queue #18 Jim North <11>

(Dave Peyton)<2> Ok, Jim

(Jim North)<11> Thank you. All of this talk about UFOs and harmonic
convervence is very interesting (though hardly simple). Am I incorrect in
stating that the real importance of this event is that it will mark a change
in individual awareness. Is this not the true significance of the "new age"?
Shouldn't our focus be within ourselves and not on rituals or UFOs?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> It is true that the real significance of this event will
be a change in our awareness anda change in our perceptions of the world.
This perceptual change will be akin to the change that occurred when people
found out that the world was round, not flat, or that the earth revolved
around the sun and not vice versa. Part of this perceptual change, then, will be the acknowldeged awareness that we are part of a galactic
stream and family of intelligence, that we are not alone. The UFOs are not
heare to save us. But they area part of our larger natural environment like
the clouds, the stars, the trees, etc. The change will be in our
non-fearfully acknowledging their presence, and pursuing the implications and
the benefits of this perceptual change.

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK

(Jim North)<11> Thank you

(Dave Peyton)<2> Howard Maculsay, the assistant moderator wants to ask a
question and because he is an assistant, he can't get into the queue so,
Howard, go ahead.

(Howard Maculsay)<1> Ok Thanks. Dr., A man's position can be "strenghtened" or
weakened by those who are giving critical review of his efforts.
Who has been critical, and why?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Do you mean people critical of Harmonic Convergence?

(Howard Maculsay)<1> Yes, Dr.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> So far very few people have been critical. The Wall
Street Journal was somewhat condescending, but hardly critical. Some
fundamentalist Christian groups are critical, but by and large, more and more
people are arising to attention everyday. The world has been without vision
for so long, that Harmonic Convergence awakens in many different kinds of
people a stirring in the breast, an ache in the heart, a recollection of
ancient power and legendary meaning that has been long lost. In this country
we last had some of this feeling in the "Camelot" aura of the Kennedy era,
and the Woodstock of the counter-culture. Well, now myth is afoot, and it is
a higher calling that arouses those who become magnetizied by Harmonic
Convergence whether they are conscious of it or not. You see, this is a
terrestrial and an extraterrestrial magnetism that is at work.

(Howard Maculsay)<1> Dr. I'm not a fundamentalist, but they certainly are
outspoken in their opposition, and more importantly, they access a national TV
audience. Please speak to their opposition.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> There is something about Harmonic Convergences that
pre-empts the fundamentalist belief that Armageddon must precede the Second
Coming. Harmonic Convergence seems like a Second Coming, they weren't in on
the planning, so they are threatened and jealous. But, there is nothing
threatening about Harmonic Convergence. It is the common of hope of the
people for a better future and a better world. Those who are truly attuned to
the Harmonic Convergence cannot be so if they are in judgement even against
the fundamentalists. The point is the expression of universal compassion,
forgiveness, and unconditional love for all of life. Those who are without
sin shall cast the first stone. Sin may be understood to mean, that which
interferes with anothers free will. Harmonic Convergence is the excercise of
the common free will on behalf of all.

(Dave Peyton)<2> It's good to know Jim and Tammy aren't going to be a part of

(Howard Maculsay)<1> Would you briefly define a "millennialist?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Traditionally defined, a millenialist is one who beleives
that the "end is at hand." From the Mayan persepective, there is no
ultimate end, only changes in the cyclic behavior of organisms involved in
galactic life. What we are witnessing is such a shift or change. It may mean
the end of the old order, industrial-military civilization, but it is also
the beginning of a new cycle, a new way of life, one that will first involve
the cleaning up of the environment and then a preparation to enter the
larger galactic life.

(Howard Maculsay)<1> I'm through, Thank you Dr.

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK. Dr.we still have several questioners and there are
still about 16 people here--I know this is grueling, and if you are too
tired, we can halt it. But if you can answer some more questions, I am sure
it would be appreciated.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> We are certainly on the same wave-length. I was just
saying to my teleprompter and good buddy, Gary, Whew! Pumping information at
the galactic gas station can sure get to be something, especially on a Sunday
night, and I've got an interview with a Toledo radio station tomorrow morning
at 7AM. But being as this is the life I chose, I'll answer at least one more

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK..

% Moderator recognizes queue #20 PAUL DAVENPORT <6>

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK Paul

(PAUL DAVENPORT)<6> Dr., I'm the director of the Florida School of Massage. We
(staff and students) are really interested in pulling this thing off. My wife
will be in LA with Scout Gunn, but we are unclear what is optimum in our
local area. Gainesville is close to Ocmulgee and Etowah, but we don't have
much experience with the park service. What do you suggest we do in our own
localities. Is there some network we can plug into? Thanks.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> I,m not sure about networks to plug into, but I can tell
you this, if it's a hassle, don't do it. The point of this whole thing is to
do what is natural what is easy, what goes with your integrity. No one is
going to be giving awards for who showed best. It is time to look into our
hearts, to look into our minds, to feel with the whole of our bodies what is
natural and right. If it turns out that way, you can be all alone in your own
back yard and get the whole charge. Another thing to keep in mind is the
practice of mental telepahty and ESP. Being in resonance means being able to
open with those like-spirited anywhere and everywhere. So be yourself, as
you are when you know you are innocent of any motives and you'll be fine.

Well, this looks like 20 questions, and in order to avoid becoming a Mayan
retread, I think I'll have to call it a night. I would like to thank
everyone for their attention and their patience. I am present because it is
imperative that the information go out on all circuits. Everybody who gets
this information has the responsibility to pass it on and communicate it in
whatever way possible. Harmonic Convergence is already happening. The
magnetism is growing more intense. The sacred moment for the renewal of the
earth and the correction of our evolutionary course has arrived. Be happy
and prepare for the awakening of your fondest dreams.

(Dave Peyton)<2> One more time, Dr., how may your book be ordered?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> People may order the"Mayan Factor" from Bear and Co.- P.O.
Box 2860, Santa Fe, NM 87504

(Dave Peyton)<2> How much should they send?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> $15.00, that includes postage.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Please carry on, and spirit be with all of us!

(Steven Hirsch)<10> Om Ah Hum!

(Gerald Swatez)<9> Bye

(Dave Peyton)<2> It was great, Dr. We appreciate you're being here.

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> Dr. Arguelles, thank you very much for your time.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Great. It was a wonderful conference. And when all this
happens, we'll be able to say we were in on it. Right?

(Mike Jones)<5> Right!

(Jose Arguelles)<12> You bet. Not only that, but because this was an
electromagnetic conference we contributed to it.

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> I hope we can pull it off.

(Jim North)<11> Thank you Dr. Argulles!

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> I'm ready.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Well, we'll be in conference on Good Earth on that Sunday

(Steven Hirsch)<10> It's Harvest Time!

(Dave Peyton)<2> Gary: Be sure and come by Aug. 16, if possible. And Dr.
Arguelles. We'd love to meet with you again after the dates, but we'll talk
about that later.

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Not a bad idea.

(Dave Peyton)<2> Sort of a de-briefing session.

(Michael Mac Cannell)<3> I suppose it would be a little much to have D.
Treadwell as a guest?

(Jose Arguelles)<12> Look to the Skies and Good Night!

(Dave Peyton)<2> OK, Night, Dr.

(David Olsson)<8> Good night, and good futures!

(Dave Peyton)<2> Be talking to you through Gary soon.

(Howard Maculsay)<1> Good Night!

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